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	<title>Comments on: Levine Files Preemption Brief With Supreme Court</title>
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	<pubDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 03:08:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: tm</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-370465</link>
		<dc:creator>tm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:30:55 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>preemption -what happens to justice for all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>preemption -what happens to justice for all.</p>
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		<title>By: Justice in Michigan</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369122</link>
		<dc:creator>Justice in Michigan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Aug 2008 02:01:40 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The Sharkey article I've been referencing can be found at

http://colloquy.law.northwestern.edu/main/2008/07/what-riegel-por.html

If you download the PDF, you'll get the whole article. (Otherwise, the site just has Part I.)

Certainly, if the Effexor history is as related, Wyeth would be shielded, which I would take as a good thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Sharkey article I&#8217;ve been referencing can be found at</p>
<p><a href="http://colloquy.law.northwestern.edu/main/2008/07/what-riegel-por.html" rel="nofollow">http://colloquy.law.northwestern.edu/main/2008/07/what-riegel-por.html</a></p>
<p>If you download the PDF, you&#8217;ll get the whole article. (Otherwise, the site just has Part I.)</p>
<p>Certainly, if the Effexor history is as related, Wyeth would be shielded, which I would take as a good thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Justice in Michigan</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369117</link>
		<dc:creator>Justice in Michigan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Aug 2008 00:34:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Also for Ava - Unfortunately, there is not much between preemption and no preemption.  Catherine Sharkey's position, which I've mentioned a few times, may be the closest.

Keep in mind that FDA approval and compliance are _already_ a part of virtually ever failure-to-warn claim. That is, even without automatic preemption, companies have been claiming for many years that they were in compliance with FDA, and that defense - if supportable - has served them well.  So it is not as though FDA approval/compliance has not been part of the picture all along.  That is also why FDA itself, until the current administration, has not viewed the tort system as competing with its own regulation.  Instead, it has explicitly described it as "complementary" in monst instances.  Please do hold on to that point - it's an important one.

The point of preemption is that FDA approval/complaince would be the _only_ thing in the picture.  And, yes, this would include even situations of a company committing fraud or other serious misrepresentations - either to FDA, physicians, or the public  

Like pregancy, I'm not sure there is such a thing as having a "little bit of preemption," but Sharkey's position may be a road to that end.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also for Ava - Unfortunately, there is not much between preemption and no preemption.  Catherine Sharkey&#8217;s position, which I&#8217;ve mentioned a few times, may be the closest.</p>
<p>Keep in mind that FDA approval and compliance are _already_ a part of virtually ever failure-to-warn claim. That is, even without automatic preemption, companies have been claiming for many years that they were in compliance with FDA, and that defense - if supportable - has served them well.  So it is not as though FDA approval/compliance has not been part of the picture all along.  That is also why FDA itself, until the current administration, has not viewed the tort system as competing with its own regulation.  Instead, it has explicitly described it as &#8220;complementary&#8221; in monst instances.  Please do hold on to that point - it&#8217;s an important one.</p>
<p>The point of preemption is that FDA approval/complaince would be the _only_ thing in the picture.  And, yes, this would include even situations of a company committing fraud or other serious misrepresentations - either to FDA, physicians, or the public  </p>
<p>Like pregancy, I&#8217;m not sure there is such a thing as having a &#8220;little bit of preemption,&#8221; but Sharkey&#8217;s position may be a road to that end.</p>
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		<title>By: Justice in Michigan</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369116</link>
		<dc:creator>Justice in Michigan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Aug 2008 00:27:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=15034#comment-369116</guid>
		<description>CMC - Your post doesn't address the mine above. I was responding specifically to Ava's post on a company wanting to _add_ a warning that FDA rejected - not about labeling negotiations in general, which I have followed pretty closely in some intances, but certainly not a "spcialty."  I agree that, if a company _removes_ or _ignores_ a warning that FDA wants on, they could be in hot water.  That's not what my post concerned.

It is possible that Laurie has cited the example I've asked for - where a company added a warning, withdrew it because of FDA disagreement, and then was sued for not having it.

Obviously, I would side with the company in such instances.  And I can't imagine they would have lost a suit if they had had to remove a warning that the FDA rejected. I am still awaiting some kind of evidence that happened - warning added, FDA rejected, company sued, suffered consequences.

I was also responding to the notion that FDA itself would hold the company for "misbranding," which is one of the stock points of the preemption folks.  Again in the context of an _added_ warning, which is what my post concerned, I do not believe FDA ever penalized a company in such a context.  The warning was simply removed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CMC - Your post doesn&#8217;t address the mine above. I was responding specifically to Ava&#8217;s post on a company wanting to _add_ a warning that FDA rejected - not about labeling negotiations in general, which I have followed pretty closely in some intances, but certainly not a &#8220;spcialty.&#8221;  I agree that, if a company _removes_ or _ignores_ a warning that FDA wants on, they could be in hot water.  That&#8217;s not what my post concerned.</p>
<p>It is possible that Laurie has cited the example I&#8217;ve asked for - where a company added a warning, withdrew it because of FDA disagreement, and then was sued for not having it.</p>
<p>Obviously, I would side with the company in such instances.  And I can&#8217;t imagine they would have lost a suit if they had had to remove a warning that the FDA rejected. I am still awaiting some kind of evidence that happened - warning added, FDA rejected, company sued, suffered consequences.</p>
<p>I was also responding to the notion that FDA itself would hold the company for &#8220;misbranding,&#8221; which is one of the stock points of the preemption folks.  Again in the context of an _added_ warning, which is what my post concerned, I do not believe FDA ever penalized a company in such a context.  The warning was simply removed.</p>
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		<title>By: CMC guy</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369093</link>
		<dc:creator>CMC guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 18:08:13 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>JIM you must have never dealt with FDA if you believe "The only consequence of adding a warning that the FDA decides is inappropriate or unnecessary is that the warning is removed". In spite of claims of coziness the reality is that interactions with industry are largely adversarial, particularly when it comes to labeling issues.  In most cases companies will submit proposed language and such but the FDA exercises final call on result.  Negotiation can be lengthy because involves clinical/technical, legal and marketing aspects and each often want certain things a specific way.  Not "obeying" the FDA can make future more problematic if a company is perceived as uncooperative (long institutional memory).  I agree companies can be hesitant to push changes especially with data is unclear (wish do not believe is hiding data) but know frustrations of dealing with FDA without precise information.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JIM you must have never dealt with FDA if you believe &#8220;The only consequence of adding a warning that the FDA decides is inappropriate or unnecessary is that the warning is removed&#8221;. In spite of claims of coziness the reality is that interactions with industry are largely adversarial, particularly when it comes to labeling issues.  In most cases companies will submit proposed language and such but the FDA exercises final call on result.  Negotiation can be lengthy because involves clinical/technical, legal and marketing aspects and each often want certain things a specific way.  Not &#8220;obeying&#8221; the FDA can make future more problematic if a company is perceived as uncooperative (long institutional memory).  I agree companies can be hesitant to push changes especially with data is unclear (wish do not believe is hiding data) but know frustrations of dealing with FDA without precise information.</p>
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		<title>By: Dianne</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369089</link>
		<dc:creator>Dianne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 17:47:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=15034#comment-369089</guid>
		<description>Ava – I’m not an attorney.  Is there a lawyer in the house?

Actually, preemption will make it virtually impossible to seek legal recourse. 

A policy that undermines our civil liberties is dangerous.  Giving product immunity to any industry in unconscionable.

Tort reformers like to play the frivolous lawsuit hand.  This has been a favorite tactic to “educate” Americans against trial lawyers.  In reality, cases without merit usually do not go to trial.  

“There are two legal mechanisms that quickly and inexpensively resolve frivolous lawsuits. The truly frivolous lawsuits are often 'thrown out of court' when the defendant files a motion to dismiss. If that fails, a defendant may still file a motion for summary judgment, which requires the plaintiff to present actual evidence that he or she 'has a case' and that there are no laws that prevent the plaintiff from winning. 

Motions for summary judgment are decided by judges – not juries - so any lawsuit that makes it past a summary judgment has some merit. Motions to dismiss and motions for summary judgment quickly and inexpensively weed out lawsuits that don’t have any merit. And often, a plaintiff on the losing end of either motion is ordered by the court to pay the defendant’s legal fees, thus discouraging people from filing frivolous suits in the first place.” - www.corpreform.com/questions_answers/index.html

It is expensive to go forward with a claim after it has been dismissed.  The average person would not be able to do so.

Most frivolous cases are filed by big corporations who can risk the cost.
See: Public Citizen &#124; Press Room - U.S. Businesses File Four Times More Lawsuits Than Private Citizens And Are Sanctioned Much More Often for Frivolous Suits  - www.citizen.org/pressroom/release.cfm?ID=1799

What we need is education about the erosion of our civil liberties under the Bush administration.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ava – I’m not an attorney.  Is there a lawyer in the house?</p>
<p>Actually, preemption will make it virtually impossible to seek legal recourse. </p>
<p>A policy that undermines our civil liberties is dangerous.  Giving product immunity to any industry in unconscionable.</p>
<p>Tort reformers like to play the frivolous lawsuit hand.  This has been a favorite tactic to “educate” Americans against trial lawyers.  In reality, cases without merit usually do not go to trial.  </p>
<p>“There are two legal mechanisms that quickly and inexpensively resolve frivolous lawsuits. The truly frivolous lawsuits are often &#8216;thrown out of court&#8217; when the defendant files a motion to dismiss. If that fails, a defendant may still file a motion for summary judgment, which requires the plaintiff to present actual evidence that he or she &#8216;has a case&#8217; and that there are no laws that prevent the plaintiff from winning. </p>
<p>Motions for summary judgment are decided by judges – not juries - so any lawsuit that makes it past a summary judgment has some merit. Motions to dismiss and motions for summary judgment quickly and inexpensively weed out lawsuits that don’t have any merit. And often, a plaintiff on the losing end of either motion is ordered by the court to pay the defendant’s legal fees, thus discouraging people from filing frivolous suits in the first place.” - <a href="http://www.corpreform.com/questions_answers/index.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.corpreform.com/questions_answers/index.html</a></p>
<p>It is expensive to go forward with a claim after it has been dismissed.  The average person would not be able to do so.</p>
<p>Most frivolous cases are filed by big corporations who can risk the cost.<br />
See: Public Citizen | Press Room - U.S. Businesses File Four Times More Lawsuits Than Private Citizens And Are Sanctioned Much More Often for Frivolous Suits  - <a href="http://www.citizen.org/pressroom/release.cfm?ID=1799" rel="nofollow">http://www.citizen.org/pressroom/release.cfm?ID=1799</a></p>
<p>What we need is education about the erosion of our civil liberties under the Bush administration.</p>
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		<title>By: laurie</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369088</link>
		<dc:creator>laurie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 16:50:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>"I can’t give specifics of the circumstance in which it happened (I can only say it’s one of my company’s competitors), "

This was probably the Effexor warning. Wyeth wanted to put the suicide/violence warning on it's labeling. The FDA was in the process of investigating this effect and told Wyeth to remove their warning until the Columbia study was completed. It was removed because the FDA wanted a consistent warning across the category of ssri/snri drugs after the study was completed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I can’t give specifics of the circumstance in which it happened (I can only say it’s one of my company’s competitors), &#8221;</p>
<p>This was probably the Effexor warning. Wyeth wanted to put the suicide/violence warning on it&#8217;s labeling. The FDA was in the process of investigating this effect and told Wyeth to remove their warning until the Columbia study was completed. It was removed because the FDA wanted a consistent warning across the category of ssri/snri drugs after the study was completed.</p>
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		<title>By: Ava</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369077</link>
		<dc:creator>Ava</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 15:31:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=15034#comment-369077</guid>
		<description>JiM-  I can't give specifics of the circumstance in which it happened (I can only say it's one of my company's competitors), but suffice it to say I have knowledge of the event independent of the preemption lobby.  They were not sued for conveying a precaution not on the label:  to the contrary... they wanted to put a precaution on the label, the FDA rejected it, and they're being sued for failing to warn consumers of that very precaution.  

And Dianne - i understand that preemption may make it harder to seek recourse in a legitimate case in which a plaintiff has been injured, but i think it's important to look at both sides: without preemption, there could be many frivilous or unfounded lawsuits alongside those legitimate ones, the one result of which would be to cause pharma to cover their legal losses by again raising the cost of medications that are already expensive enough.  This is not to say i'm for unconditional preemption or for an unconditional lack of preemption.  Perhaps there needs to be some other means by which situations such as this could be avoided.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JiM-  I can&#8217;t give specifics of the circumstance in which it happened (I can only say it&#8217;s one of my company&#8217;s competitors), but suffice it to say I have knowledge of the event independent of the preemption lobby.  They were not sued for conveying a precaution not on the label:  to the contrary&#8230; they wanted to put a precaution on the label, the FDA rejected it, and they&#8217;re being sued for failing to warn consumers of that very precaution.  </p>
<p>And Dianne - i understand that preemption may make it harder to seek recourse in a legitimate case in which a plaintiff has been injured, but i think it&#8217;s important to look at both sides: without preemption, there could be many frivilous or unfounded lawsuits alongside those legitimate ones, the one result of which would be to cause pharma to cover their legal losses by again raising the cost of medications that are already expensive enough.  This is not to say i&#8217;m for unconditional preemption or for an unconditional lack of preemption.  Perhaps there needs to be some other means by which situations such as this could be avoided.</p>
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		<title>By: Justice in MI</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369075</link>
		<dc:creator>Justice in MI</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 15:22:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=15034#comment-369075</guid>
		<description>Ava = What you heard is actually preemption lobby propaganda.  The only consequence of adding a warning that the FDA decides is inappropriate or unnecessary is that the warning is removed.  It virtually never happens, in any case.  And it does not require preemption if it did - once again, the FDA just does what it always does.

If you know of a case in which a company has been sued for conveying a precaution not otherwise on the label, please do let us know.  Otherwise, it is one of those "rumors" that have a way of coming from to Corp Lawyers, Inc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ava = What you heard is actually preemption lobby propaganda.  The only consequence of adding a warning that the FDA decides is inappropriate or unnecessary is that the warning is removed.  It virtually never happens, in any case.  And it does not require preemption if it did - once again, the FDA just does what it always does.</p>
<p>If you know of a case in which a company has been sued for conveying a precaution not otherwise on the label, please do let us know.  Otherwise, it is one of those &#8220;rumors&#8221; that have a way of coming from to Corp Lawyers, Inc.</p>
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		<title>By: Dianne</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/08/levine-files-preemption-brief-with-supreme-court/#comment-369073</link>
		<dc:creator>Dianne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 14:26:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=15034#comment-369073</guid>
		<description>Ava – What happened in the circumstance you mentioned?  If it was something that resulted in a trial, then the plaintiff and defendant each had an opportunity to seek justice. 

FDA preemption takes away the right of the injured party to seek justice.  If we are stripped of that right, the facts of a case will not come out, industry will be shielded, and our health and safety will be in peril.

I would rather stay with Freedom and Justice for All.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ava – What happened in the circumstance you mentioned?  If it was something that resulted in a trial, then the plaintiff and defendant each had an opportunity to seek justice. </p>
<p>FDA preemption takes away the right of the injured party to seek justice.  If we are stripped of that right, the facts of a case will not come out, industry will be shielded, and our health and safety will be in peril.</p>
<p>I would rather stay with Freedom and Justice for All.</p>
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