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	<title>Comments on: More Kids Are Taking More Meds Than Ever Before</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/</link>
	<description>News, Comment and Conversation</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 10 Feb 2012 20:56:40 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Trolla</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380483</link>
		<dc:creator>Trolla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Nov 2008 09:34:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380483</guid>
		<description>Interesting - focus of comments is on the anti-psychotic drugs, and not the others being rx for kids:  diabetes, hypertension and cholesterol meds.  The main contributor - obesity.  Our kids eat too much take out junk (sweets, designer beverages, fried foods) and portions are too big. Too little exercise. Nutrition needs to be addressed as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting - focus of comments is on the anti-psychotic drugs, and not the others being rx for kids:  diabetes, hypertension and cholesterol meds.  The main contributor - obesity.  Our kids eat too much take out junk (sweets, designer beverages, fried foods) and portions are too big. Too little exercise. Nutrition needs to be addressed as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Lewis</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380386</link>
		<dc:creator>Lewis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 14:54:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380386</guid>
		<description>Has anyone noticed that the data used for this study came from Express Scripts - a PBM? Based on their business model, they don't get paid if the drugs don't get dispensed.  What is their incentive to curb this trend and what policies are they implementing to ensure appropriate prescribing?  Who are they really working for?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Has anyone noticed that the data used for this study came from Express Scripts - a PBM? Based on their business model, they don&#8217;t get paid if the drugs don&#8217;t get dispensed.  What is their incentive to curb this trend and what policies are they implementing to ensure appropriate prescribing?  Who are they really working for?</p>
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		<title>By: An FDA Reviewer</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380380</link>
		<dc:creator>An FDA Reviewer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 13:32:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380380</guid>
		<description>Lisa,

If you really want to do something useful.

See the comments from the following post about the FDA reviewer who is being fired

(http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/10/preemption-the-business-case-of-the-century/#comments)

and get people to have Congress look into it.

The person is a pediatric psych drug reviewer.

An FDA Reviewer</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lisa,</p>
<p>If you really want to do something useful.</p>
<p>See the comments from the following post about the FDA reviewer who is being fired</p>
<p>(http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/10/preemption-the-business-case-of-the-century/#comments)</p>
<p>and get people to have Congress look into it.</p>
<p>The person is a pediatric psych drug reviewer.</p>
<p>An FDA Reviewer</p>
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		<title>By: atlex</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380369</link>
		<dc:creator>atlex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 12:36:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380369</guid>
		<description>LVS,

First, this is not a Pfizer sponsored study. Based on the stusy's write-up, Pfizer was only asked to supply study medication and nothing more. There is no reason for Pfizer to sponsor a study for Zoloft since the product has lost exclusivity (almost all use of sertraline is in its generic form and not branded Zoloft).  For that same reason, there is no entity with any interest in taking this study to the FDA for "approval."  Your speculation has no basis in reality or logic; it amounts to nothing more than baseless conspiracy theory. 

Atlex</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LVS,</p>
<p>First, this is not a Pfizer sponsored study. Based on the stusy&#8217;s write-up, Pfizer was only asked to supply study medication and nothing more. There is no reason for Pfizer to sponsor a study for Zoloft since the product has lost exclusivity (almost all use of sertraline is in its generic form and not branded Zoloft).  For that same reason, there is no entity with any interest in taking this study to the FDA for &#8220;approval.&#8221;  Your speculation has no basis in reality or logic; it amounts to nothing more than baseless conspiracy theory. </p>
<p>Atlex</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa Van S</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380299</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa Van S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 22:53:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380299</guid>
		<description>One more thought!! It was Pfizer who combined two negative studies to form one positive. Pretty Sad... Kindergarten Math... Ouch!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One more thought!! It was Pfizer who combined two negative studies to form one positive. Pretty Sad&#8230; Kindergarten Math&#8230; Ouch!!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa Van S</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380298</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa Van S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 22:51:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380298</guid>
		<description>Salmon and Atlex,

Do the two of you really care about the validity of this study? Then tell the NIMH and Pfizer to release the "RAW DATA"...... Its just that simple!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Salmon and Atlex,</p>
<p>Do the two of you really care about the validity of this study? Then tell the NIMH and Pfizer to release the &#8220;RAW DATA&#8221;&#8230;&#8230; Its just that simple!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa Van S</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380297</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa Van S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 22:47:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380297</guid>
		<description>Atlex,

One only has to ask two questions in regards to the Zoloft Study...

Does this Study meet the requirements for FDA approval?

Why was this study not!.. presented to FDA approval.

These are the only two questions that matter!... Who the Hell cares what the Media or the Industry apologists have to say.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Atlex,</p>
<p>One only has to ask two questions in regards to the Zoloft Study&#8230;</p>
<p>Does this Study meet the requirements for FDA approval?</p>
<p>Why was this study not!.. presented to FDA approval.</p>
<p>These are the only two questions that matter!&#8230; Who the Hell cares what the Media or the Industry apologists have to say.</p>
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		<title>By: Salmon</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380295</link>
		<dc:creator>Salmon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 22:43:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380295</guid>
		<description>Thank you for referring me to the data table. I stand corrected. Based on what is presented in this table I have to agree, that in this study report there was no greater amount of suicidality reported on Zoloft as compared to placebo.

I was simply sloppy and thought that the 2 cases were both on Zoloft.

Salmon</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for referring me to the data table. I stand corrected. Based on what is presented in this table I have to agree, that in this study report there was no greater amount of suicidality reported on Zoloft as compared to placebo.</p>
<p>I was simply sloppy and thought that the 2 cases were both on Zoloft.</p>
<p>Salmon</p>
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		<title>By: atlex</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380283</link>
		<dc:creator>atlex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 20:59:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380283</guid>
		<description>Salmon,

Be my guest to stand by completely made up data. Go look at the study itself.  Your data is incorrect.  See Table 3 at this link.

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0804633#T3

Atlex</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Salmon,</p>
<p>Be my guest to stand by completely made up data. Go look at the study itself.  Your data is incorrect.  See Table 3 at this link.</p>
<p><a href="http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0804633#T3" rel="nofollow">http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0804633#T3</a></p>
<p>Atlex</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Salmon</title>
		<link>http://www.pharmalot.com/2008/11/more-kids-are-taking-more-meds-than-ever-before/#comment-380277</link>
		<dc:creator>Salmon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 20:07:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=17191#comment-380277</guid>
		<description>Atlex,

I stand by my remarks regarding suicidality.

Suicidality includes not only suicidal and homocidal ideation and suicide attempts but actions such as self injury and even thoughts of self harm. These are metrics that Columbia University used when they verified the conclusions of two different groups of FDA reviewers on suicidality with antidepressants in adolescents.

The rate of suicidality was approximately 2 out of 300 on Zoloft. I've seen raw data on suicide and suicidality rates in other studies and the rate of completed suicide for other drugs is typically around double the rate of suicidality. Based on the sample size for the entire study and the rates of completed suicide for other drugs I would have to say that even before the study began it should have been obvious to anyone familiar with the expected rates for antidepressants that there was a very low chance of seeing any completed suicides.

It's very important that companies include enough subjects in these studies to properly evaluate the risk, otherwise it's likely to be entirely missed in practice. This is simply because of the numbers.

A typical child psychiatrist can only see about 500 patients a year and fewer are going to be on any particular drug. Thus a child psychiatrist might see 1 suicide every several years and they are likely to think that it's the underlying disease and not think it's the drug. Only companies and the maybe the FDA are likely to collect sufficient postmarketing safety information to make the connection.

Salmon</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Atlex,</p>
<p>I stand by my remarks regarding suicidality.</p>
<p>Suicidality includes not only suicidal and homocidal ideation and suicide attempts but actions such as self injury and even thoughts of self harm. These are metrics that Columbia University used when they verified the conclusions of two different groups of FDA reviewers on suicidality with antidepressants in adolescents.</p>
<p>The rate of suicidality was approximately 2 out of 300 on Zoloft. I&#8217;ve seen raw data on suicide and suicidality rates in other studies and the rate of completed suicide for other drugs is typically around double the rate of suicidality. Based on the sample size for the entire study and the rates of completed suicide for other drugs I would have to say that even before the study began it should have been obvious to anyone familiar with the expected rates for antidepressants that there was a very low chance of seeing any completed suicides.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s very important that companies include enough subjects in these studies to properly evaluate the risk, otherwise it&#8217;s likely to be entirely missed in practice. This is simply because of the numbers.</p>
<p>A typical child psychiatrist can only see about 500 patients a year and fewer are going to be on any particular drug. Thus a child psychiatrist might see 1 suicide every several years and they are likely to think that it&#8217;s the underlying disease and not think it&#8217;s the drug. Only companies and the maybe the FDA are likely to collect sufficient postmarketing safety information to make the connection.</p>
<p>Salmon</p>
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