Comments on: Feeling Neurotic? Then Take An Antidepressant http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/ News, Comment and Conversation Fri, 10 Feb 2012 22:14:47 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: Ana http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-456273 Ana Wed, 06 Jan 2010 00:53:56 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-456273 I am a neurotic and I did 20 years of psychoanalysis that ended in 2008. I'm amazed that GSK has the guts to use the word neurosis and Paxil at the same line. There is no medicine for neurosis. Maybe a diazepam, never clonazepam because it is too damn addictive but physicians say it is not, to help anxiety. The word "neurosis" is not used any longer and now soldiers are not diagnosed "war neurotic". They are diagnosed PTSD because a disorder can be treated with pills. Where is the DSM-5? Some psychiatrists want it to end and it would be the right thing to do. Seriously. IF psychiatrists don't don anything to stop the crimes they are promoting I don't know what to think about humankind. If those who are supposed to help... blah blah blah.... Nemeroff, Biederman... Shame, to say the least. Thank you for the great work Ed Silverman! I'm always commenting at Furious Seasons and never commented here I don't know why. I am a neurotic and I did 20 years of psychoanalysis that ended in 2008.
I’m amazed that GSK has the guts to use the word neurosis and Paxil at the same line.
There is no medicine for neurosis. Maybe a diazepam, never clonazepam because it is too damn addictive but physicians say it is not, to help anxiety.
The word “neurosis” is not used any longer and now soldiers are not diagnosed “war neurotic”. They are diagnosed PTSD because a disorder can be treated with pills.
Where is the DSM-5? Some psychiatrists want it to end and it would be the right thing to do.
Seriously.
IF psychiatrists don’t don anything to stop the crimes they are promoting I don’t know what to think about humankind.
If those who are supposed to help… blah blah blah….
Nemeroff, Biederman… Shame, to say the least.
Thank you for the great work Ed Silverman!
I’m always commenting at Furious Seasons and never commented here I don’t know why.

]]> By: Chay in MI http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-452035 Chay in MI Thu, 17 Dec 2009 19:53:57 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-452035 Did anybody ask if these test subjects were really depressed? Or how it was determined that that they were depressed? Well, I was recently diagnosed as severely depressed and immediately prescribed Zoloft. Yes, I was tested, I did the 6 questions or was it 8? Anyway, the questions were few and no matter how you answered them you would be determined depressed to some degree. The good doctor never asked what might be bothering me, didn't inquire about any life events that might be depressing, or anything about my life at all. Shame, if he had I would have told him that 7 weeks ago I lost my closest, dearest, and longest friend suddenly. Someone so close she might as well have been my sister. It hadn't been a year since I lost my father, my aunt, and 3 of my cousins and barely 2 years since the death of my mother. Forgive me for being a bit down on some days, ya know. Not to mention that I lost my best friend a few days before my own birthday and Thanksgiving. This will be the first Christmas we didn't go shopping together. In my book, grieving is normal, not diseased. I understand that they have a similar test for kids for ADHD. Aren't we lucky to have advanced to the point where it's so easy to be diagnosed as a mental case based on less than 20 questions. I'm surprised I wasn't given Paxil. It wouldn't have matter much anyway, I haven't and have no intentions of taking any antidepressants ever. I'm not crazy. Did anybody ask if these test subjects were really depressed? Or how it was determined that that they were depressed?
Well, I was recently diagnosed as severely depressed and immediately prescribed Zoloft.
Yes, I was tested, I did the 6 questions or was it 8? Anyway, the questions were few and no matter how you answered them you would be determined depressed to some degree.
The good doctor never asked what might be bothering me, didn’t inquire about any life events that might be depressing, or anything about my life at all.
Shame, if he had I would have told him that 7 weeks ago I lost my closest, dearest, and longest friend suddenly. Someone so close she might as well have been my sister.
It hadn’t been a year since I lost my father, my aunt, and 3 of my cousins and barely 2 years since the death of my mother.
Forgive me for being a bit down on some days, ya know. Not to mention that I lost my best friend a few days before my own birthday and Thanksgiving. This will be the first Christmas we didn’t go shopping together.
In my book, grieving is normal, not diseased.
I understand that they have a similar test for kids for ADHD.
Aren’t we lucky to have advanced to the point where it’s so easy to be diagnosed as a mental case based on less than 20 questions.
I’m surprised I wasn’t given Paxil.
It wouldn’t have matter much anyway, I haven’t and have no intentions of taking any antidepressants ever.
I’m not crazy.

]]> By: Justice in MI http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-451073 Justice in MI Sat, 12 Dec 2009 03:00:42 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-451073 I agree that the interview with Dr. Tang is a good follow. I would continue to suggest, however, that this remains a study that is limited and ambiguous. The definitions of "neuroticism," and its links to "depression," are "established" in the minds of those who have made it their career to think in such terms. None of this is news to people in the field--it has been asserted for more than a dozen years. Likewise, the various imaging studies that purport to give it credence. None of that enhances the significance of this particular study, or makes it more convincing to those among clinical and personality psychologists who begin with different premises and define the "what" of personality in different ways. None of that is a criticism of Dr. Tang's personal dedication. I agree that the interview with Dr. Tang is a good follow.

I would continue to suggest, however, that this remains a study that is limited and ambiguous. The definitions of “neuroticism,” and its links to “depression,” are “established” in the minds of those who have made it their career to think in such terms. None of this is news to people in the field–it has been asserted for more than a dozen years. Likewise, the various imaging studies that purport to give it credence.

None of that enhances the significance of this particular study, or makes it more convincing to those among clinical and personality psychologists who begin with different premises and define the “what” of personality in different ways.

None of that is a criticism of Dr. Tang’s personal dedication.

]]> By: Atlex http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-451065 Atlex Sat, 12 Dec 2009 02:28:52 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-451065 Ed, Nice job on your follow-up with Dr. Tang. He comes off as a sincere researcher looking to improve medical care. Atlex Ed,

Nice job on your follow-up with Dr. Tang. He comes off as a sincere researcher looking to improve medical care.

Atlex

]]> By: Lisa Van Syckel http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-450999 Lisa Van Syckel Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:35:20 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-450999 Betsy,. Your singing to the choir. Betsy,. Your singing to the choir.

]]> By: Betsy Jacobson http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-450991 Betsy Jacobson Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:34:23 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-450991 First, I'd like to know the extent of the pharmaceutical's financial benefits from the manufacturing and marketing of Paxil as a result of its trials. I'd also like to be sure how much we actually know about the Paxil trial results, because we often don't know how much is actually published about them. Pharmaceuticals have a nasty habit of often omitting negative trial results even from the FDA for obvious reasons. In 1998, a Professor/psychiatrist/researcher from the University of Oslo in Norway came to New York to speak at my Fibromyalgia conference about Paxil, and by the time he arrived in the U.S. he had to sadly report to the assembled doctors and patients that his university's trials didn't work at all for depression (and all its permutations). This was 11 1/2 years ago. We know now that most SSRI's and SNRI's can cause suicidal ideation and depression, speaking of neuroticism, so this is very dangerous stuff. Marcia Angell, MD wrote in her book, The Truth About Drug Companies, How They Deceive Us and What To Do About It, that between 2002 - 2004, researchers found that placebos for SSRO's were 80% as effective as the drugs tested, and Paxil was one of these. Dr. Angell is Senior Lecturer in the Dept. of Social Medicine at Harvard Medical School, and used to be editor-in-chief of the New England Journal of Medicine. First, I’d like to know the extent of the pharmaceutical’s financial benefits from the manufacturing and marketing of Paxil as a result of its trials. I’d also like to be sure how much we actually know about the Paxil trial results, because we often don’t know how much is actually published about them. Pharmaceuticals have a nasty habit of often omitting negative trial results even from the FDA for obvious reasons.

In 1998, a Professor/psychiatrist/researcher from the University of Oslo in Norway came to New York to speak at my Fibromyalgia conference about Paxil, and by the time he arrived in the U.S. he had to sadly report to the assembled doctors and patients that his university’s trials didn’t work at all for depression (and all its permutations). This was 11 1/2 years ago.

We know now that most SSRI’s and SNRI’s can cause suicidal ideation and depression, speaking of neuroticism, so this is very dangerous stuff.

Marcia Angell, MD wrote in her book, The Truth About Drug Companies, How They Deceive Us and What To Do About It, that between 2002 - 2004, researchers found that placebos for SSRO’s were 80% as effective as the drugs tested, and Paxil was one of these.

Dr. Angell is Senior Lecturer in the Dept. of Social Medicine at Harvard Medical School, and used to be editor-in-chief of the New England Journal of Medicine.

]]> By: truthman30 http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-450879 truthman30 Fri, 11 Dec 2009 12:28:04 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-450879 Truthman, You may not like the results, but the study was done independently by a psychologist (Dr. Tang, not Mr. Tang) who only received pills and placebos from GSK. He received no financial support from GSK and none of the authors report any financial ties to pharma. As usual, you blame pharma without knowing the facts. Atlex As far as I can see Atlex, there are no concrete facts at all from this study, it's over blown sensationalism ... Oh .. and I only ever address someone as "Dr" if I feel that they embody the ethos of a "Doctor" ... I don't see any ethos here, I see pseudo-research masquerading as science... There is one thing that we can draw from this sudy though... Paxil certainly does change personalities and behavior ... Unfortunately NOT IN A GOOD WAY ... Truthman,

You may not like the results, but the study was done independently by a psychologist (Dr. Tang, not Mr. Tang) who only received pills and placebos from GSK. He received no financial support from GSK and none of the authors report any financial ties to pharma.

As usual, you blame pharma without knowing the facts.

Atlex

As far as I can see Atlex, there are no concrete facts at all from this study, it’s over blown sensationalism …

Oh .. and I only ever address someone as “Dr” if I feel that they embody the ethos of a “Doctor” …

I don’t see any ethos here, I see pseudo-research masquerading as science…

There is one thing that we can draw from this sudy though…

Paxil certainly does change personalities and behavior … Unfortunately NOT IN A GOOD WAY …

]]> By: Lisa Van Syckel http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-450690 Lisa Van Syckel Thu, 10 Dec 2009 16:54:49 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-450690 raw data, I'm "L.M.A.O",... Thank You, I needed it. raw data,

I’m “L.M.A.O”,… Thank You, I needed it.

]]> By: raw data http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-450670 raw data Thu, 10 Dec 2009 15:28:11 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-450670 LVS SAID "I’d like to see further review of this study,. with the raw data included!!" Yes, every study ever published puts out all of the raw data for you to examine.... As someone who has actually done a little "clinical research" - i.e. examined trials and put together data for a meta-anaylysis - I can tell you most researchers are comfortable providing the raw data to you. Now I have actually been trained to examine the data and they might not release that info to just anyone, but it hasn't been a problem for me. Many things are available if you ask nicely LVS SAID “I’d like to see further review of this study,. with the raw data included!!”

Yes, every study ever published puts out all of the raw data for you to examine…. As someone who has actually done a little “clinical research” - i.e. examined trials and put together data for a meta-anaylysis - I can tell you most researchers are comfortable providing the raw data to you. Now I have actually been trained to examine the data and they might not release that info to just anyone, but it hasn’t been a problem for me. Many things are available if you ask nicely

]]> By: Justice in MI http://www.pharmalot.com/2009/12/feeling-neurotic-then-take-an-antidepressant/#comment-450664 Justice in MI Thu, 10 Dec 2009 15:06:23 +0000 http://www.pharmalot.com/?p=20310#comment-450664 Look up the thread--it's one of those "neurotic" states. I suppose I hoped to give Ed a bit of a rise too. Look up the thread–it’s one of those “neurotic” states. I suppose I hoped to give Ed a bit of a rise too.

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